My '85 MGM, "Maisa"

[Arquemann]

The game might be over before it even started...

In stock form, does the TV lever at the trans bottom out at WOT?

In the pic below, TV rod adjustment is maxed out, the trans end is bottomed out, and I'm missing about that much on the rod... When attached to the carb linkage, it does do full sweep of the carb-end movement.



I could probably bend the TV rod, but I don't know what kinda clearance issues and wonky geometry issues that'll entail...

[Tiggie]

The TV does bottom out on the trans end. During some adjustment, I set the pressure so high on my 88 that it kept me from WOT due to this. That was a little much... so I backed it down.

Can you make a short extension to the TV rod with some metal and a bolt?

[Arquemann]

The TV does bottom out on the trans end. Can you make a short extension to the TV rod with some metal and a bolt?

That's what I expected... I could probably fabricobble something together. While not for the AOD, there's exactly what I'm looking for designed for the C6:
It's literally just an extension to the C6's similar kickdown rod. https://www.summitracing.com/parts/hly-20-41

[Arquemann]

Well I did exactly just that:
Not as pretty as the Holley part, but a solid 100% cheaper. The TV rod also has less play now, new end has a slightly smaller hole.


I tried to install the rod so the trans end bottoms out just before the carb end, but actually actuating the rod from the carb end doesn't quite seem to achieve that, so it might require more adjustment down below.
That'll be seen tomorrow, if the pressure is high enough WOT, the trans end adjustment might done already.

The pressure gauge is installed for the linkage adjustment aswell. But HOLY SHIT that was probably the third worst thing I've ever done.
Dunno if anyone here has actually used the TV test port on a stock exhaust box. The cats and trans crossmember are unbelievably well right in the fucken way.
The small hex head plug comes out alright with a tiny ratchet and long socket. Even so there's very little room to actually swing the ratchet.

Now the real problems started, as the thread adapters for my pressure gauge kit all have 18mm heads... Since the TV test port is recessed, a socket will not fit around the hex. And would you guess that an 18mm open-end wrench is quite long. Conveniently way too long to even try to swing it around without hitting the trans tunnel.
Just before I cut an open-end 18mm wrench in half, I managed to find a palm-sized adjustable wrench. With that damn tiny wrench I turned the adapter in, quarter turn after quarter turn. Skiftnyckel? More like Skitnyckel.
I've spent probably 2 hours under the car today, and my neck says the same. I'm totally beat and worn.

Hopefully tomorrow when I slap the trans in neutral and press the gas, ATF won't jet out from around the adapter, it's an O-ring seal who knows if it'll hold even near the 100+ psi the gauge can read...


In other news, I connected the CFI's choke wire to the Holley choke cap and adjusted the choke cap all they way "lean". The choke doesn't stay on too terribly long that way.
I'll have to adjust the fast idle screw, the fast idle feels too high for me , but the adjustment screw is in absolutely shit position and I can't seem to get a wrench on it no matter what. Probably a carb-off case.

[sly]

Yes... very tight working under there next to the trans. Right pain in the arse.

[slack]

I used the TV test port to double check my pressure in my CV after I swapped out the busted stock TV cable with a longer one from an 80s mustang that I adjusted. It's been about 9 years since I did that but I remember it being annoying to get everything in place with the pressure gauge and stuff. That said, it did put my mind at ease seeing that the pressure was right and I wasn't going to blow my trans up.

Btw, that's nice work on the TV rod extension. Way nicer than anything I would have slapped together. lol

[Arquemann]

The rod is long enough to bottom out the trans at WOT, but it doesn't pull back enough at closed throttle. The travel / geometry is skewed and I know why.

The CFI TV linkage starts pretty much at 12 o'clock position in relation to the throttle shaft. WOT is a bit beyond 3 o'clock. This means there's pretty much the same amount of vertical movement as horizontal movement.
In comparison:
The carb "TV" linkage starts at 10 o'clock and bottoms out after 1 o'clock. In this travel, the position of the TV stud goes slightly up and then starts going down.

TV stud (screw & bushing) at WOT:


Both achieve approximately 90° of travel, but in different closed and wide open throttle positions. Due to the trans end moving mainly vertically due to the longer radius and relatively short rotation, the screwed up horizontal movement of the carb won't achieve full travel at the trans end.
This could be remedied if the TV stud on the carb linkage was moved more clockwise. It wouldn't even be too bad to accomplish, except the extended linkage would hit the secondary throttle shaft linkages. No dice.

Obviously, I should go the same route as Brown_Muscle, and cobble the CFI linkages to the Holley linkages, like I intended to, before my imagination took over and I spent way too much time on this shit before realizing it won't work.
There's a couple problems with that;
-my fabricobbling skills fall short of what Brown_Muscle created with his linkage adaptation
-the wider linkage means the throttle cable bracket needs to be modified extensively
-the wider linkage will highly likely hit the factory air cleaner
-alot of extra tension on the carb throttle shaft bushings due to the longer leverage horizontally.
-it will still be complete ass to adjust

As much as I'd like to pioneer this shit, my fabrications skills are basically non-existent.
We'll see what happens, can't say for now.

[Arquemann]

Also I had a fun time initially trying to check the TV pressures this morning, my gauge records the highest readings and needs a button press to release the pressure from the gauge. Doing that makes the button go SPLURT and fart out warm ATF. Miniature Exxon Valdez under the fcking car right now. Atleast I had a drip pan.

With higher pressures on the TV port, I believe the adapter O-ring blew out and the port started seeping ATF, which I originally didn't see, because it dripped onto the catalytic converter right below. Conveniently the cats started getting warm enough for the ATF to start burning and smoking...

[kishy]

I am fairly sure that WOT on CFI does not bottom out the TV rod, even with TV set fairly aggressively. But I only think to remark on this when I'm at work and can't go prove it on my actual car.

Just a consideration. You're using a gauge, so if you get numbers you like but the rod isn't bottomed out, go by the numbers.

One thing you might run into, however, is that in the quest to get it firm enough at low TV but not slamming so hard you knock your teeth out, your geometry changes might make it hard to achieve the middle ground. I have found with both my 84 and 85 that there is a sharp cutoff point where it transitions from mildly slushy to hard slamming engagement, so finding that spot and setting it just below it would be how I'd be doing it by feel.

When I had my 91 set "professionally" by gauge at a transmission shop, I found it intolerably slushy. With the cables as on SEFI, I find them best behaved with some pre-tension at throttle closed, which by most accounts is entirely too much because correct specs seem to put some slack on the cable at throttle closed.

[Arquemann]

I am fairly sure that WOT on CFI does not bottom out the TV rod, even with TV set fairly aggressively. But I only think to remark on this when I'm at work and can't go prove it on my actual car.

Just a consideration. You're using a gauge, so if you get numbers you like but the rod isn't bottomed out, go by the numbers.

One thing you might run into, however, is that in the quest to get it firm enough at low TV but not slamming so hard you knock your teeth out, your geometry changes might make it hard to achieve the middle ground. I have found with both my 84 and 85 that there is a sharp cutoff point where it transitions from mildly slushy to hard slamming engagement, so finding that spot and setting it just below it would be how I'd be doing it by feel.

When I had my 91 set "professionally" by gauge at a transmission shop, I found it intolerably slushy. With the cables as on SEFI, I find them best behaved with some pre-tension at throttle closed, which by most accounts is entirely too much because correct specs seem to put some slack on the cable at throttle closed.

Should have mentioned what happened before the realization of the rod not going to work out.
I did have the pressure gauge installed, and at WOT I got dead on 85 psi, which is right in line with what it's supposed to be. It was maybe quite not completely bottomed out at the trans end.

Basically the WOT adjustment was spot on, going by numbers. But at closed throttle, the TV pressure was over 40 psi. That 40 psi was as low as I could get it adjusted, without actually removing the rod from the carb end.
Removing the carb end and pulling forwards/up on the rod did get the appropriate 0-5 psi at closed throttle, but the eyelet on the rod end wouldn't line up to anything anymore.
Due to the screwed up geometry, closed throttle at the carb end wouldn't lift up the rod at trans end correctly.

With the different position of the linkage travel on the carb, the rod was too long at idle and correct at WOT or vice versa.


As much as I wanted for the rod to work, I can't be bothered to modify every single thing needed to get the geometry fixed, which would include modifying the CFI linkages, attaching them to the Holley, modifying the rod some more, modifying the throttle & cruise bracket and then the whole adjustment happyhappyfuntime.

I've ordered the Lokar TV cable.

[matth825]

Crap I should have kept my mouth shut and not made my comment about everything lining up. Looks like I jinxed it lol. I was really hoping that there was a way you could make the rod could be made to work without heavy mods. Hopefully the Lokar cable shows up soon and you can get on the road.


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[DerekTheGreat]

...Doing that makes the button go SPLURT and fart out warm ATF...

ATF or umm, chocolate pudding if an actual fart shouldn't have been trusted.

[Arquemann]

Crap I should have kept my mouth shut and not made my comment about everything lining up. Looks like I jinxed it lol. I was really hoping that there was a way you could make the rod could be made to work without heavy mods. Hopefully the Lokar cable shows up soon and you can get on the road.


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Meh, this project was going suspiciously well. If something doesn't go wrong or cause notable extra challenge during a project, it will soon afterwards.
Brown_Muscle showed it can be done, but he modified this and that aswell. I thought I could avoid some of it and no, I couldn't.

[Arquemann]

First test drive is completed!

TV pressure was set accordingly, to right about 35psi with the gauge block installed. Resulted in pretty mushy and early shifts. Nothing too drastic and will be adjusted in the coming days.
Only complaints I have of the Lokar cable kit is the fact that the return spring wasn't actually enough to get the lever bottomed out at idle (pretty common it seems) and the trans TV lever nut is aluminium. Added my another return spring, now the gas pedal is pretty heavy, so I'll probably do some "adjusting" on that too.
I can't really understand the usual "flimsy" comments of the Lokar kit.

Install was pretty straightforward, the carb end linkages get kinda fiddly since there's the factory throttle cable brackets and now the Lokar bracket. I don't have a carb spacer and the intake is very low profile so the fine adjustment nuts on the TV cable are in a pretty inconvenient spot. I can adjust them barely by hand, no chance to fit spanners. Room for improvement, not for else.





The L-bracket on the trans pan bolt is installed as instructed, I was wondering if flipping it would compress the spring enough for the TV lever to actually bottom out closed. The black inner sleeve might be too long for that though.
I'll start "lightening" the throttle pedal by first removing the CFI return spring I reinstalled, by the results I might even remove the long Lokar supplied spring on the trans end, and just use my custom made return psring at the trans plus the one on the factory throttle cable.

Soon we shall find out if this whole shitshow actually cured the jerky decel...

[gadget73]

wait until the set screw lets go at the carb end or one of the brackets bends for no apparent reason.