how does the stock sound system rate?

[zoomie]

Nevermind, I'm an idiot. I looked up that model radio, and the faceplate should just be internal (and pops out when you power it up). It probably isn't missing at all

But I'm still curious: do I need to run the 4 basic speakers off of the head unit, or can I direct them through the amp...?
And, any advice as to which in the current lineup of bestbuy or walmart speakers will be best?
I realize it's to-taste, but I've no experience in sound systems. I just want something that doesn't suck, for maybe $40-$100 (especially now that I don't have to buy a head unit any longer)

your best bet is to use speakers powered from the deck, then use a monoblock amp for the subs, if you have the coin best speakers ive heard for car are the polk audio DB series loud,clean,crisp if you have to buy walmart go with the pioneers they usually sound pretty good, just dont put a whole lot of bass htrough them, thats wat the sub is for, i usually tune my amp to anything below 60 htz or so goes to the sub if you can make it to SF bring your stuff and ill install your radio amp subs and speakers for ya.

btw that unit is not a detachable face it is a chameleon face though it slides out of the deck,and 50x4 deck is plenty of loud with a ton of options, kenwood makes some nice elctronics but speakers and car amps arnt their strong point, but decent enough to add bass, if and when you decide to upgrade i would reccommend alpine typeR subs and a decent monblock, like infinity or hifonics oh alpine makes some nice speakers too havnt heard them yet though

[85crownHPP]

Do you know how many channels your amp has? unless its a 4 + 1 speaker/sub output, just run the interior off the deck. No good way to power them and a sub from one amp.

[gadget73]

depending on the amp, you may be able to run the speakers through it, or you may not. truthfully, you'll get enough sound powering the speakers straight off the head unit that its not absolutely needed to run them through the amp. If you want to, then you can, but you'll need a 4 channel amp for the in-car speakers, plus one more channel for your sub. Usually this is done with 2 separate amps, but I suppose someone may make a 5 channel amplifier just for this sort of thing.

I only made mention of how silly the claimed power ratings are because, well, its silly. You don't need huge power levels to make a good amount of sound. If you've got a solid 15 real actual watts per channel, that will do it. Power ratings now are in "music power" or peak power or some other mostly meaningless figure. It makes for big numbers, but a "200 watt" head unit isn't nearly as powerful as an amplifier that makes an honest 200 watts rms. As both an electronics guy and an audio guy, I find such misleading figures annoying.

[BerniniCaCO3]

Ahh, yes, I had that conversation with a buddy of mine.
I was complaining about how sears used to (maybe they still do? haven't checked in a few years) overrate the horsepower on their shop tools.

Everybody else's 1hp bench grinder, would be 2hp at sears. A tablesaw? 3hp, not 1.5hp. Many generic shop tools are virtually identical across brands, probably the same chinese factory, so you know something's up when a dozen clones have twice the horsepower from Sears, than from Jet, Delta, Grizzly, etc.

Turns out they were rating the horsepower at the moment it because to stall and burn up, I forget what they were calling it. But a useless measurement; I don't exactly want to hear that I'm getting 3hp out of my tablesaw just because the blade has caught and the motor is starting to short!

I was just looking at best buy, they have polk brand speakers. I assume that I can go with cheaper 50watt (root mean square-- I think they're "150 watt" by the peak, and useless, measurement) speakers, as my head unit won't be able to supply 100watt in any case!

[BerniniCaCO3]

nor will I want to ruin my hearing with 600 watts combined speaker output anyway, even if I bought the speakers and amp to supply it!

OH, before I forget to ask, there are 2-way, 3-way, and 4-way speakers. Someone told me that relates to frequencies covered? A 4-way speaker will do bass, treble, and a couple ranges in between?

Now, I have 4 standard speakers, I'm adding the subwoofer; so no reason to get 4-way speakers when they won't even do the bass well anyway. Should I get 3-way? or 2-way? what is the practical difference? (again, noob at audio stuff). I don't have tweeters.

[85crownHPP]

2-way is fine... anything more is just gimmick. If you can swing a set of component speakers ( a 'one-way' interior woofer with satellite mount tweeter) that's the way to go. Getting the high range up high makes a world of difference.

[gadget73]

the more "ways" there are to a speaker means the more individual drivers. A full range, or one way, speaker attempts to reproduce all frequencies from 20hz-20khz. A two way will have a crossover so there is one large driver doing low frequencies, and a smaller one doing highs. Three way gives you a bass, a mid, and a high frequency driver, and so on and so forth. it will still try and reproduce the bass, but the additional splits may give you better mids and highs. A 3 or 4 way will probably do you fine. My door and dash speakers are actually 2 ways. Best advice I can offer is to push the buttons at BB and listen to them. Buy what sounds good to you.

[sly]

12v @ 10A = 120W (10A fuse in my head unit) Also, these values of per channel power are peak values based on capacitor discharge over a very short period of time. People don't typically run a DC signal to their speakers. Sustained/RMS/nominal values are usually a third or less than the peak. so 180W/3 = 60W nominal. Probably my head unit would do 40-80W all day. It's all the difference between DC and AC currents. Speaker output is definitely AC and thus can make much higher peak power than the sustained DC input.

[BerniniCaCO3]

Does anyone know what size the front door speakers are in an 1990 grand marquis?

My head unit has 4 channels @ 50watts each.
I want to understand this correctly:
wattage just equals volume? So if I don't need it loud, I won't take advantage of a high wattage speaker?
Rated wattage, at root mean square, just means the wattage that you put in with a given tolerably low distortion? So if I were to buy speakers that were rated for only 40 watts RMS and I have a head unit that produces 50 watts, when I turn up the volume all the way I'll have some distortion (but since the speaker is rated for 150 watts peak, it won't blow out)? If I don't need the volume up all the way, some inexpensive 40 watt RMS plastic-coned speakers will still be a fine improvement over 20yr old paper coned originals?

Sadly the guy at best buy was unable to clarify any of that; he didn't know his stuff... :-(

Second question. I haven't analyzed the head unit yet, but how many channels would it have? Its built in amp is good for 50 watts per each of 4 channels, but can the head unit have a 5th, unamplified channel, to talk to my independent amp and subwoofer?
I also need to look at my amp, but if most amps can drive at least 2 or 3 speakers, here's what I'm wondering: Maybe use the amp to drive the front speakers and the subwoofer, and then use the head units smaller 200 watt amp to drive the rear speakers and maybe even put in two tweeters?

For those who have: where could I install tweeters, and keep them aesthetic?


Final question;
the subwoofer my sister gave me came out of a bonneville with a deep trunk. I'm putting it in my colony park wagon under the hatch where the 3rd row of seats would have been, if my wagon had the 3rd seat option.
The box for the subwoofer is thus just a little too tall, or too deep, depending.

Does orientation matter? Whether the speaker is pointed straight up and pressed almost against the steel doors, or do I need ot keep it pointing mostly forward towards the front (maybe at a slight angle if it's too tall)?
And, if I build my own new box for it, just use a solid 3/4" plywood? Or use braced 1/8" plywood or even quartersawn spruce/ cedar like an instrument's soundboard?
What are the physics/ acoustics behind subwoofer box engineering? Not looking to make it perfect, but if there are little useful tips in building a subwoofer box that resonates well, I want to pay them heed. I never like being totally ignorant.

[85crownHPP]

Does anyone know what size the front door speakers are in an 1990 grand marquis?

5 1/4

My head unit has 4 channels @ 50watts each.
I want to understand this correctly:
wattage just equals volume? So if I don't need it loud, I won't take advantage of a high wattage speaker?
Rated wattage, at root mean square, just means the wattage that you put in with a given tolerably low distortion? So if I were to buy speakers that were rated for only 40 watts RMS and I have a head unit that produces 50 watts, when I turn up the volume all the way I'll have some distortion (but since the speaker is rated for 150 watts peak, it won't blow out)? If I don't need the volume up all the way, some inexpensive 40 watt RMS plastic-coned speakers will still be a fine improvement over 20yr old paper coned originals?

yes... the 50w rating on that head unit is MAX out anyway... realistically they only put out a clean 20ish RMS power.

Second question. I haven't analyzed the head unit yet, but how many channels would it have? Its built in amp is good for 50 watts per each of 4 channels, but can the head unit have a 5th, unamplified channel, to talk to my independent amp and subwoofer?

yes - this will be an RCA 'pre-amp' output on the back of the head unit, if it has one (all do these days)

I also need to look at my amp, but if most amps can drive at least 2 or 3 speakers, here's what I'm wondering: Maybe use the amp to drive the front speakers and the subwoofer, and then use the head units smaller 200 watt amp to drive the rear speakers and maybe even put in two tweeters?

maybe... IF the amp has separate frequency filters for each pair of speaker channels (assuming a 4 channel amp) or if its a 5 channel amp, in which case you can power everything off the amp. Done with a 4 channel amp, it probably wont have means to independantly adjust the levels, so the sub and interior speakers will be getting the same amount of power (might be a bad thing)

For those who have: where could I install tweeters, and keep them aesthetic?

High on the A-pillars - I hardly notice mine up there, except for the sound coming out of them.

Final question;
the subwoofer my sister gave me came out of a bonneville with a deep trunk. I'm putting it in my colony park wagon under the hatch where the 3rd row of seats would have been, if my wagon had the 3rd seat option.
The box for the subwoofer is thus just a little too tall, or too deep, depending.

just dont close the hatch, it will impeded the bass waves and may rattle. it may still sound good enough for you though.

Does orientation matter? Whether the speaker is pointed straight up and pressed almost against the steel doors, or do I need ot keep it pointing mostly forward towards the front (maybe at a slight angle if it's too tall)?

yep - try to make it fire right at the tailgate and bounce back into the passenger area.

And, if I build my own new box for it, just use a solid 3/4" plywood? Or use braced 1/8" plywood or even quartersawn spruce/ cedar like an instrument's soundboard?
What are the physics/ acoustics behind subwoofer box engineering? Not looking to make it perfect, but if there are little useful tips in building a subwoofer box that resonates well, I want to pay them heed. I never like being totally ignorant.

Go with a sealed box, its best all around. ports and vents only work for certain frequencies, being in a waggin, a sealed box will pound your face off just fine. The sub will come with an airspace volume spec you will need to mind. MDF works fine for sub boxes, 5/8" is fine for 10's and smaller, 3/4" for 12's and up.

[sly]

5 1/4" ??

I put 6.5" speakers in my doors (88 MGM) Did they shrink the hole on the 90 model?

Mind you I had to drill out the holes for the screws because the stock triangle won't allow mounting the grill that came with the speakers (since the doors didn't have the factory door speakers and I had to cut the panel to make a hole for the speakers). But a 6.5" speaker fits fine in that hole.

[monterey1962]

'88-'91 take 6.5" aftermarket speakers in the doors. I've mounted 6.5" Pioneers in both door styles. '88/'89 require you drill a couple of mounting holes. '90/'91 require the drilling of one hole in the plastic mount.

I have Pioneer 3-ways in my '88 GM's doors with '90-style speaker mounts. The sound blows me away.

[85crownHPP]

Well I put 5 1/4"s in my 91, no modifications needed.

[monterey1962]

Well I put 5 1/4"s in my 91, no modifications needed.

What brand? Btw, I wasn't saying you were wrong. I should have stated it as "they take up to 6.5 inch". However, now someone will chime in and prove that a 10" sub-woofer will fit in the door. :p

[gadget73]

I believe the stock size is 5 1/4", or 6 1/2" if you remove or modify the plastic spacer ring.