sunpro gauges: several questions!

[BerniniCaCO3]

Hi!

I'm installing the sunpro triple gauge (oil pressure, temperature, and voltage), and also a tachometer.

First question:
The temperature sensor has a 1/4 NPT thread on the end. In fact, I'm not sure that there are ANY threaded entrances to the water jacket, only plugs to oil jackets? Is this meant to go into oil, and the idea is that oil temperature and coolant temperature should be pretty darn close?

Second. The oil pressure gauge is mechanical --seems there's no triple gauge option with electrical, and I've bought and paid for the mechanical now anyway-- but I was only later advised by a friend that a pressurized line into the dash is not the best of ideas.
I plan to zip tie it away from the anything hot or sharp, of course, and I might consider buying that steel conduit to protect it?
Any advice on whether you've heard of these lines coming off under pressure and leaking (I'm not quite clear on how the little connections are supposed to keep that line firm!)

Third. The oil gauge isn't the only bit being run through the firewall, I have the other three gauges too. When I did my audio work, I forced a stiff wire through an existing hole. That ain't going to work anymore: these are small wires, delicate wires, and they just won't fit: I'll be punching a fresh hole in the firewall. Just get a quality holesaw bit or a friggin giant 3/4" drill bit with a 3/8" shank (if such exists!) and punch through where it seems to be safe? How do I go about sealing it up when I'm done?

I'm thinking about a short 2" of pvc pipe, sharp edges cleaned up, run my wires, and pump it full of silicone. But if ever there's a short, or god forbid the oil line bursts, that'll be kinda nonserviceable. And seems half-assed and sloppy besides.

Other suggestions for a cleaner and more responsible way to run wires through the firewall?

Four. The relay that connects to the autolights when it gets dark, and turns on the dash lights too, is that easy to get to? I'll consult a wiring diagram. But it would be great if I can have my extra gauges turn on, too, when it gets dark.

Five. This is a part of my engine overhaul. Right now my car is occupying a bay at the school shop, and the sooner I get it out of there, the less likely I'll be to piss off instructors (they're tolerant so far), and the sooner I can give my father his spare car back. I want to install all of these gauges, and I want to do my heater core, and maybe even my multi-switch (got a new one; old cancelcam beginning to wear). These could all take some time, and can be done at home without a lift.
Is there a small amount of trim say around the steering shaft that I can remove, drill through, run my wires through and just leave the gauges hanging there on the floor until such time as I can bring the car home and take the dash apart and install them properly?

Or am I going to want the dash apart before I think of where I'm running my wires to?

[86VickyLX]

1.Oil temperature will never be close to coolant. In fact it'll be almost 2 times hotter lol.
You should have adapters in your kit. Pull the idiot light sender out of the intake up front, and thread in your adapter. It should be 3/8npt. Use some teflon tape or goo to make sure of a good seal.

2. I replaced the nylon tubing that came with my oil pressure gauge with metal when mine decided to spring a leak and shoot 4 quarts onto I-95 and leave me stranded.
I used Nylon going into the passenger compartment since it won't be exposed to heat like up by the exhaust. You'll need a second coil of nylon to bring it into passenger compartment so you can position the gauge where you want it.

3. Steal body plugs from a car in the junkyard, drill a hole to size, put a hole in the middle of the plug, and feed the wires through.

4. On '89 down models it's behind the radio I think. You gotta remove radio to access it.
Why do you want to mess with that anyway? If you're looking for a light source with dimming capabilities, splice into the ashtray light wiring.

5. I zip tied my lines along the bottom of the dash, so they'd be out of the way of my feet. They don't interfere with me removing the trim panel covering the fuse box or anything.
If you're thinking of putting these gauges somewhere besides under the ashtray, you might want to have your dash down so you can route your wires so it's neat and tidy.

[87gtVIC]

Hi!

I'm installing the sunpro triple gauge (oil pressure, temperature, and voltage), and also a tachometer.

First question:
The temperature sensor has a 1/4 NPT thread on the end. In fact, I'm not sure that there are ANY threaded entrances to the water jacket, only plugs to oil jackets? Is this meant to go into oil, and the idea is that oil temperature and coolant temperature should be pretty darn close?

John covered it.

Second. The oil pressure gauge is mechanical --seems there's no triple gauge option with electrical, and I've bought and paid for the mechanical now anyway-- but I was only later advised by a friend that a pressurized line into the dash is not the best of ideas.
I plan to zip tie it away from the anything hot or sharp, of course, and I might consider buying that steel conduit to protect it?
Any advice on whether you've heard of these lines coming off under pressure and leaking (I'm not quite clear on how the little connections are supposed to keep that line firm!)

There is nothing wrong with the supplied nylon line. Incompetence gives the nylon line a bad name...I have heard it across boards but it really is no problem. Make sure to boil a pot of water and drop the coiled line in it to unravel the line making it easier to handle. Route it away from all heat sources and protect it with some convoluted tubing inside the engine bay and inside the car just to be safe.

I had this set up on my car for two years and had not one problem. The lines seal with a ferrule (gauge end and block end). The ferrule seats and secures the line very snugly.Just follow the supplied instructions, as they tell you how to set it up.

Third. The oil gauge isn't the only bit being run through the firewall, I have the other three gauges too. When I did my audio work, I forced a stiff wire through an existing hole. That ain't going to work anymore: these are small wires, delicate wires, and they just won't fit: I'll be punching a fresh hole in the firewall. Just get a quality holesaw bit or a friggin giant 3/4" drill bit with a 3/8" shank (if such exists!) and punch through where it seems to be safe? How do I go about sealing it up when I'm done?

I had a horrible time trying to get the line for the temp. gauge to seal. The freaking protective coil made it difficult because of all the various angles water could come in. I cannot give any advise on how to run it because I have had no success with it..But you are restricted to the 6 feet or so of line they give you...no way to extend that whatsoever.

I'm thinking about a short 2" of pvc pipe, sharp edges cleaned up, run my wires, and pump it full of silicone. But if ever there's a short, or god forbid the oil line bursts, that'll be kinda nonserviceable. And seems half-assed and sloppy besides.

Other suggestions for a cleaner and more responsible way to run wires through the firewall?

Four. The relay that connects to the autolights when it gets dark, and turns on the dash lights too, is that easy to get to? I'll consult a wiring diagram. But it would be great if I can have my extra gauges turn on, too, when it gets dark.

Just tap into the fused side of the headlight fuse within the fuse box.

Five. This is a part of my engine overhaul. Right now my car is occupying a bay at the school shop, and the sooner I get it out of there, the less likely I'll be to piss off instructors (they're tolerant so far), and the sooner I can give my father his spare car back. I want to install all of these gauges, and I want to do my heater core, and maybe even my multi-switch (got a new one; old cancelcam beginning to wear). These could all take some time, and can be done at home without a lift.
Is there a small amount of trim say around the steering shaft that I can remove, drill through, run my wires through and just leave the gauges hanging there on the floor until such time as I can bring the car home and take the dash apart and install them properly?

Just do all of the gauges at home. It is something you dont want to rush. And besides the only part that would be easier with a lift is assembling the connectors that go into the block for the oil pressure gauge. I did it on the floor so you can to...just is a pain because with the oil filter installed there is very little room to turn a wrench down in that area.

Or am I going to want the dash apart before I think of where I'm running my wires to?

You will be fine installing the gauges with the dash installed. Just make sure to do it after you do the heater core to ensure you are not putting any stress on the wires once the dash is down for that job.

I wrote my thoughts in bold.

[Tiggie]

Thoughts about #2 and #3:
I have the same gauges in my '88. I used the oil line that came with it. Follow the directions and you'll be fine but keep tabs on the engine side. After 25,000 miles, mine was brittle down near the exhaust manifold. I replaced it last summer with nylon again.

About running the wires through the firewall: I used a 3/4in holesaw along with a leftover universal Mr. Gasket PCV valve cover grommet. With the wires covered in plastic conduit and taped sealed, it was a perfect fit and very neat. I drilled to the right side of the steering column. There is a nice space between where the accelerator pedal mounts and the brake booster. Eyeball it from outside and you'll get it right.

[BerniniCaCO3]

Thanks tiggie for the advice on the firewall! I need to get a good holesaw: my harbor freight set was softer than the mild steel I was trying to cut, I swear: took off the paint from the steel, then, the teeth off the saw

What IS the water temperature line, and, what were your problems with it?
(that is to say, it looks like a copper tube, not electrical wire, so I'm curious how the sensor works?)
I found some holes in the lower intake that look like they feed into the water jacket, going to be using them. Well, I think they do anyway... it's twin looks like a vacuum line! So maybe I've just installed it into intake, hahaha... The 1/4 NPT threaded holes in the back and the front? Front is definitely coolant, back holes I'm not as sure about?

[BerniniCaCO3]

If those ports I'm talking about in the rear of the lower intake ARE vacuum/intake ports, not coolant-- can I install a T junction in the front port and keep my original coolant sensor still functional (sunpro and original sensors hanging off either side of the junction)? Or, unlike the 40psi of oil pressure, will the coolant not quite push up into the T junction and I might end up reading air temperature?

There's another oil plug just over a foot back on the block which is perfect for the oil line, doesn't need to go up by the filter. I'm going to try to install everything in the shop, just, the gauges will be lying loose but functional on the floor of the car until such time as I can get the dash apart.

I know that I can dim and brighten my console backlights: you mean the cigarette lighter backlighting is on that same circuit? (I don't have my car here to go and check myself right now). That will make wiring the lights a cinch.
The water and oil gauges are pure mechanical, right?
The ammeter however, that will leach power, correct? So I suppose I'll be getting friendly with my electrical manual, but, there are going to be numerous hot power feeds in the dash that only come on when the key is in the ignition and turned so that the ammeter isn't drawing power 100% of the time, and I can tap into any of these? Actually, radio power feed might do fine, and it's right there and I'm familiar with it.

If I put them in the space where a passenger airbag could have been -but is not- I'll be able to see them if I crane my neck over, which is good enough just to check that things are healthy. Is that too hokey though? Or should look alright (aesthetic advice wanted).
I've got a cd changer down under the center console, otherwise I'd think about that position longer.

[86VickyLX]

What IS the water temperature line, and, what were your problems with it?
(that is to say, it looks like a copper tube, not electrical wire, so I'm curious how the sensor works?)

If we're talking about a mechanical gauge, it's basically a temperature probe, like a thermometer. It's not removable from the gauge. It cannot be extended/shortened. So you are limited to where you can put the gauge. For proper readings, you should put the probe where the idiot light sender was. You also have the choice of the EGR cooler feed (from lower intake), or the other side of the intake in the rear.
GT40 intakes do not have this. You can add it but you need the proper drill bit and tap to do it.

Wherever you're putting the gauge, it has to be installed there, and then the probe needs to be installed where it's going to go. So you have to route it through the firewall etc.

[87gtVIC]

Wherever you're putting the gauge, it has to be installed there, and then the probe needs to be installed where it's going to go. So you have to route it through the firewall etc.

This. x100

Sounds as if op was not thinking about this.

For illumination look through your vehicles EVTM. Look for the fuse that takes care of instrument illumination. Then just tap into the fused side of that and your gauges will dim and come on just like all of your other instrumentation lights.

Also after re-reading my original post it sounds as if I was a little harsh about the people that have FAIL stories about the nylon line. No doubt about it the copper is better but the nylon if okay to use and should not scare you.

[85crownHPP]

Ditto on putting the temp sensor probe where the stock temp switch for the dummy light is, in the LF corner of the lower intake. You dont need the stock switch anymore since you have a gauge. The engine computer reads temp from a different sensor. Your gauge kit should have come with the right adapter to use.
The mechanical temperature gauge uses a thin copper gas filled tube - the gas heats up and puts pressure on the gauge, moving the needle. Cutting or kinking this tube will make the gauge useless.

As far as the copper/nylon oil psi tubing... use at your own risk. Like others said, the nylon gets brittle after years, and the copper is very thin and easy to break. Both are subject to damage under the hood and the dash, shit happens. Do you really want a 1 in 50 chance that it breaks and starts pumping your oil out? Nah.
Just becuase some people got lucky with theirs *so far* doesn't mean you will. When most people don't like something, its best to avoid it.

DO NOT INSTALL THAT AMP GAUGE... you essentially have to re-route your alternator charge wire into the car and into a shitty gauge... they are known to melt and catch fire if not done right. Just get a volt meter and be done.
And, do yourself a favor and get some electrical gauges. There's a reason cars haven't come with mechanical gauges for decades... they are a liability.

[85crownHPP]

here's a helpful link -

Complete box panther gauge installation how-to

[87gtVIC]

Oh yeah.Pete reminded me....just purchase a voltmeter and install that instead of the amp meter. I had an amp meter in the car and it was not exciting...volt meter is much more useful.

[P72Ford]

I've always used mechanical gauges. Historicaaly they are much moe accurate than electric.

I always use nylon for the oil pressure, but I slip the line inside some small vacuum hose, to protect it. Some silicone spray makes the nylon slip into the hose much easier.

Eventually I will make a hose (if I have trouble with the one in my truck).

aThe car, I went with electric gauges for the first time, because I wanted a cleaner install.

[1987cp]

I second returning the whole kit and buying an electric mini-panel with only the gauges you want (volts, water temp, oil pressure). Problem solved. My sedan's PO installed the AutoGage mini panel, and it's very nice.

[sly]

electrics in mine. way easier running wire through the firewall since you can run it where you want and aren't limited by hose length.

[BerniniCaCO3]

thanks guys. I ordered 2 electric sunpro gauges (water temp & oil pressure) today. They weren't so expensive, and will fit right into the triple gauge bracket I already bought.
I might still keep the mechanical water temp: I can decide in a couple days when I fit it