91 GM with snow tires or find a 4WD vehicle?

[Stealthlead]

I recently moved up to southern Colorado with my 1991 Grand Marquis. Its got the stock rear end and no snow tires yet, didn't think it was going to start snowing heavy in the beginning of October ._. I live up in the mountain (its all paved road though) about 10 minutes out of town. On my way home today me and a bunch of fwd guys got stuck on some icy patches. The fwd's got out of it and I did too but just barely, I was fishtailing all over the place getting out of it. Wasn't giving it excessive gas or anything, but I had to keep a little momentum going uphill. I'm a bit inexperienced driving in the snow but I have done it on occasion before.

My question is, is it worth it to spend $500+ whatever on a set of four snow tires or would it be better to use that as a payment on a 4wd Subaru or something? (I say that because I see probably 10 Subaru's for every other car here.) I don't have any weight in the back yet either but the whole point of this thread is to get an idea if its even worth trying to drive her in the conditions here, I mean the snow today was the first and its going to get A LOT worse...

I won't be selling the GM, ever, and if I end up getting a second car it'll end up being the DD while I get work done on the GM. Ideally I'd really like a truck... but F150's don't come cheap

[jaywish]

It is best if you have a posi unit for snow & hills. Plus snows. I don't know how much you drive and can you afford to have two vehicles.

[sxcpotatoes]

Our cars are FWD if you turn around and go up all the hill backwards! Just like the old Model T's with the gravity fed fuel pumps!

[Piece-it pete]

LOL!

I used studded snows on the back and never give a second thought to snow. I tried snows on the front too but they were too soft for me, they'd 'turn over' on freeway offramps in the dry. Never used anything like Blizzarks though.

Pete

[Stealthlead]

It is best if you have a posi unit for snow & hills. Plus snows. I don't know how much you drive and can you afford to have two vehicles.

From the few threads I've read on the matter, most people with posi's instead of peg-leggers are a lot happier in the snow. If there is a way to make it so she performs half decent in the snow I have no problem putting cash down for tires and even a new rear end (now I have an excuse :p). I can't really afford a new car but either way the winter comes regardless, and I really need to do something about this. But if all I'm doing is putting cash into a car that will never have good manners in the snow, then I thought to myself I might as well get something else for now. The idea of a posi is really appealing to me... I wanted to get a new rear end for her anyways something like a 3.73. Would a higher ratio be good in the snow?

LOL!

I used studded snows on the back and never give a second thought to snow. I tried snows on the front too but they were too soft for me, they'd 'turn over' on freeway offramps in the dry. Never used anything like Blizzarks though.

Pete

So I take it if I get snow tires studded is the best way to go, but only in the back?

Thanks for the replies! It looks like complete winter time outside, I'll get a pic later.

[1987cp]

I ended up with a set of severe-snow-rated light truck tires, and ran four of them.

Where's the video that one guy in Michigan posted of the new Powertrax differential?

[colognecapri]

You will be amazed at how well a RWD car will work, even without traction control or ABS, with a proper set of FOUR snow tires. I took my manual trans/T5/4.0L V6, no ABS/TRAC 2007 Mustang to the upper peninsula of Michigan on a snowmobiling trip, all my friends thought I was crazy and that I would get stuck but I did just fine. However, with the stock Pirelli PZero Nero 235/55-17s, it was absolutely hopeless in a few inches of snow, as in stuck in the driveway hopeless, even though they were 4 season tires. You NEED real snow tires, not just all seasons.

My 96 Grand Marquis LS was also amazing; I got a set of LX Sport 17's for the summer but put a set of Dunlop snow tires on the stock HPP 16" lacy wheels and they worked really good in deep snow. No sandbags in the trunk, etc., just good snow tires make a huge difference.

For example, Saab and Volvo didn't make AWD cars until very recently because they felt it was unnecessary with proper snow tires even though they obviously have extreme winter conditions in Sweden. The marketing department needed AWD to satisfy customer demands. however.

All this being said, having owned Subarus, a well designed AWD or 4WD system is amazing and is almost unstoppable. You can drive an AWD Subaru through snow that is almost coming over the hood with no problem!! There is a reason why you see so many Subarus in Utah and Colorado. But don't give up on the Panther, it will only let you down in the most severe conditions if you get a set of snows.

[Billy]

I had been though plenty of Massachusetts winters in panthers and I've had 2 snow tires, no snow tires, open diffs, limited slip, stock gears, lower gears, doesn't matter, I've found that these cars will do just fine in the snow in stock trim on normal tires. The secret is to just add a little bit of weight to the trunk and to use your brain when driving.
I really didn't find enough difference when I had snow tires to justify buying a pair. I actually sold mine off and just went back to stock tires.

[85crownHPP]

If your area was mostly flat, a panther with posi, good snow tires, and weight in the back would do just fine.

Being in a mountainous area though, I would not even try. I don't care what setup you are working with, any RWD car is NOT going to do well going up or down icy inclines/declines.
Even studded ice tires are going to be no good on a packed ice incline. Flat packed ice - sure. Steep packed ice, no. Hills, maybe. Mountains, no.
I would want something with ABS too. I don't care how good of a driver you are or your tires are, if you loose traction on a steep windy downhill icy slope, you will not recover.

Do you see very many other big RWD cars around out there? If not, there is probably a good reason, lol...

[crazyman]

Don't discount the thought of running all terrain truck tires.. I had some bfg all terrains, 235/75r15's on the back of the 87 GM I drove briefly in HS. It would drive right through 8-10" or so on the unplowed backroads..

[jaywish]

Just thought I would throw in something I did not realize for a long time.
Posi converts a 1 wheel drive powered axle to a 2 wheel drive axle.
AWD and 4wd vehicles have two powered axles.
Many of them do not have posi so they are really 2 wheel drive vehicles. (1 wheel in the front & 1 wheel diag in the back)
Putting posi in a single drive axle car makes it close to many of the AWD vehicles out there.

[pantera77]

Four (not two, stopping and steering is just as, if not more important then accelerating) snow tires and a trac-lok and I've never had any problems in the snow with the winter beater wagon.

[GM_Guy]

Even if you buy a Subie, you will still want four snow tires for it. One wheel, four wheel, ten wheel drive makes no difference if the tires can't grab hold.

Alex.

[85crownHPP]

Putting posi in a single drive axle car makes it close to many of the AWD vehicles out there.

But, even the one wheel turning up front with the weight of the engine on it is worlds better than two spinning on the rear. Also, if an axle with posi gets both wheels spinning, the back end will drift off the side of the road - usually right into a ditch, unlike a one wheel spinner...

[mitymerc]

You will be amazed at how well a RWD car will work, even without traction control or ABS, with a proper set of FOUR snow tires. I took my manual trans/T5/4.0L V6, no ABS/TRAC 2007 Mustang to the upper peninsula of Michigan on a snowmobiling trip, all my friends thought I was crazy and that I would get stuck but I did just fine. However, with the stock Pirelli PZero Nero 235/55-17s, it was absolutely hopeless in a few inches of snow, as in stuck in the driveway hopeless, even though they were 4 season tires. You NEED real snow tires, not just all seasons.

My 96 Grand Marquis LS was also amazing; I got a set of LX Sport 17's for the summer but put a set of Dunlop snow tires on the stock HPP 16" lacy wheels and they worked really good in deep snow. No sandbags in the trunk, etc., just good snow tires make a huge difference.

For example, Saab and Volvo didn't make AWD cars until very recently because they felt it was unnecessary with proper snow tires even though they obviously have extreme winter conditions in Sweden. The marketing department needed AWD to satisfy customer demands. however.

All this being said, having owned Subarus, a well designed AWD or 4WD system is amazing and is almost unstoppable. You can drive an AWD Subaru through snow that is almost coming over the hood with no problem!! There is a reason why you see so many Subarus in Utah and Colorado. But don't give up on the Panther, it will only let you down in the most severe conditions if you get a set of snows.

Do you have German Capri?