building up a 351 Cleveland

[Archangel]

One of my buddies has that beast, a '70 or '71 small-block Cleveland with some ridiculously huge heads (4V code), valves are big enought to swallow a tennis ball. He wants to build the thing up and team it with a 5-speed stick, but he has some questions:

1. this Cleveland's main bolts are pretty fat but still only two per bearing, does anyone make a main girdle for 2-bolt blocks?

2. is there an air intake that will allow use of EFI and that will bolt to those early '70s 4V heads? Also what cam + ECM combo will be good for that engine? We want to run fuel injection cause pretty much everyone and their mother uses carbs, plus there is also the learning and gaining experience factor.

3. What is a good software that has the ability to completely reprogram ECMs? Price is not such an issue as it will be split between several people, but the software needs to work with both FoMoCo and GM engines, probably even DCX ones.

As of right now it's completely unknown what vehicle that motor is going into, there is possibility of a '95 Stang but nothing is certain until the car is parked in my buddy's dad's garage

[Roach III]

:bump:

A Buddy of mine offered a 351C block to me for $25. Looks to be in order. No heads or anything.

[Grand Marquis GT]

Im looking to build a 4V quench Cleveland myself...

With a 5 speed.. My idea!!!!

[Mercracer]

You do not need to reinforce the webbing on a Cleveland unless you are going to spin it. You do however have to worry about oiling and thin cylinder walls. It is $247 for an adapter to put an EFI 351W lower on a Cleveland block with Cleveland 4V heads. The other option is to use a carb intake converted to EFI.
A FAST (Speed Pro) system is one of the excellent options to support any combo you can come up with.

[Archangel]

Mercracer, than you for your input. We already know about the oiling issues, and my buddy has already researched about the whole plug-and-redirect deal. What about the cylinder walls though, how much overbore can they handle? My buddy wants to get it to more than 8000rpms and make the most power up high, is that what you refer to "spinning"? As for converting a carbed intake to fit EFI, how does one go for that - I assume some welding is required for the bungs where the injectors would go in, correct?

[Mercracer]

You need to sonic check the bores. Sometimes only .030 is too much. If you are going to turn it 8000RPM+, then you need to O-ring the heads, get a forged rotating assy, probably fill the block, and definitely do the oiling mods.
The Super Victor EFI 351W intake Part number 29245 (29246 with the rails) and the Price Motorsport intake adapter to the 351C 4V heads is what you want. Add a throttle body elbow and you are in business.

[Grand Marquis GT]

I've never understood "filling" the block.

Doesn't that remove all cooling properties??

[DuceAnAHalf]

I've never understood "filling" the block.

Doesn't that remove all cooling properties??

you loose some surface area to cool with. Usually is reserved for drag motors. A guy i know is running a 414W with the block Half-filled. Car has about 12 passes and 10 street miles. 600+HP to the wheels without the spray, AFAIK he has no cooling problems.

[Grand Marquis GT]

But if you plan on cruising the car at ALL...

You really need to not do that.

[Mercracer]

I've never understood "filling" the block.

Doesn't that remove all cooling properties??

Most of your heat is in your heads and pistons, not in the lower 1/2 of your cylinders.

[Archangel]

Mercracer, seems like plans are changing - the 4V heads are going to be used, but because of all the issues with the Cleveland block my buddy's currently debating whether to bolt them to a 351W or a 302HO block. Clearly there are some mods that need to be done to the heads for that swap, but he claims it's doable... If he goes the Mustang way I'd assume the SuperVictor intake you suggested won't work cause of the different deck heights of the blocks, correct?

[gadget73]

You'd need either a factory Boss 302 type intake, or a special clevor intake for a 351. There is also some mod work to the top of the block you have to do for cooling passages. I seem to recall Mercracer posting info on the conversion a few months back.

[DuceAnAHalf]

http://www.darkhorseracing.net/clevor_head_mod.htm

[DuceAnAHalf]

There are almost always 400M motors at the junkyard. would those heads be worth a damn?

[Southern_Pride]

Price motorsports sell the adapter to put any 302 intake on a 302 with the clevland/modified heads. Im sure they have the 351 ones too. As far as I understand get the 2 barrel heads for a street motor or and application where you want low end torque. The true boss motors use for barrel heads and they flow awesome at high rpm but you lose all your low end power.