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exhaust leak? fuel economy?

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    exhaust leak? fuel economy?

    I did the HO swap (kindof) a while ago; I've now driven 400 miles on my new engine and been through a couple tanks.
    My first tank, perhaps due to zealous revving of my new engine, perhaps also do to a failsafe thermostat that had gotten itself stuck open for no good reason whatsoever, netted 10mpg: 150 miles, and 15 gallons to refill back to a full tank.

    My second tank should have been a fairer indication. I played less, commuted more, and had a working thermostat.
    12.5mpg.

    My old lopo used to get 18mpg all day long. I think 15mpg was my worst tank, and 24mpg was my best.
    12.5mpg is... something might be a little off.


    There's another thread here about someone's '87 with a vacuum leak. That should not be my problem. (a) I replaced all the easy vacuum lines, anyway, in the engine bay. (b) until I corrected it by cleaning the IAC and resetting the tps voltage at idle, I was idling at 500rpm. Now it's 700rpm (hot). And vacuum at idle is a healthy 20" Hg. So I could do a smoke test... but improbable.

    The engine is running smoothly. Brandy new injectors. No misses at all. So obvious rough-running horrible tuning issues for which fuel economy is the least of your worries are not present. Other than vapor out of the exhaust when the engine's cold on a dreary rainy day, no smoke. Nothing obvious manifesting.


    What else can lead to poor fuel economy?


    The reason I ask about exhaust leaks is because i never did retighten the header bolts after I installed them. Why not? Because some instructor talked me into putting header wrap on my headers, making installation a *bitch.* I've got the mustang headers on now, btw; with the independent flanges, which didn't help since they'd shifted a little and lining up the holes was hard. I did not use loctite, and there was no space for a lockwasher.
    They were hard to tighten, though I DID tighten them, even when the engine was out of the car! Now I don't know how I'd get to half of them at all.
    Also, while the oem exhaust has flat flanges, the mustang headers and the mustang h-pipe have a ball and socket. I did not find, and therefore did not use, a gasket for this socket: it seemed like maybe it should just be metal to metal tightened hard.

    So I'm wondering (a) if that ball and socket should've had a gasket anyway... and (b) if heat cycles can loosten bolts? and (c) one coworker said he heard a little exhaust leak.
    I'm wondering if I really should make the effort to tighten all the header bolts again, then. How tight do they need to be anyway? Just snug, like upper:lower intake manifold kindof tight?
    I'm wondering if an exhaust leak upstream of the O2 sensors could let fresh air in, convince the O2 sensor it's lean, and cause the engine to run rich, wasting fuel economy?

    I'm wondering if there's a way to really VERIFY an exhaust leak rather than just guessing at what's plausible... and then confirm if it's fixed after tightening bolts. I've never really diagnosed exhaust leaks before.

    #2
    exhaust leaks upstream of the o2 would do it. they didn't use donut gaskets from the factory though and if lined up good and tight they shouldn't leak.

    have you scanned it for codes? and verified it gets into proper operating temperature?
    Give a man a fish and he will be fed for a day. Teach a man to fish and he will promptly forget that he once did not know, and proceed to call anyone who asks, a n00b and flame them on the boards for being stupid.

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      #3
      O2 sensors or bogging due to use of od. What kind of driving?
      1989 Grand Marquis LS
      flat black, 650 double pumper, random cam, hei, stealth intake, Police front springs, Wagon rear, Police rear bar, wagon front ,exploder wheels, 205/60-15 fronts 275/60-15 rears, 1 5/8" headers, 2.5" offroad x pipe, Eclipse front bucket seats, Custom floor shifter, 4.10 gears, aluminum driveshaft and daily driven. 16.77@83mph

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        #4
        Yeah, exhaust leaks are easy to find, but your hand around and feel for air movement. Also look for carbon marks. Listening too.... Exhaust leaks before the O2 introduce 02 in and the ECU will add fuel to try and compensate-which makes for a crappy running car. I just replaced a header gasket on mine. Big difference.
        Builder/Owner of Badass Panther Wagons

        Busy maintaining a fleet of Fords

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          #5
          what rear gear ratio? If its the stock 3.08 or 3.27, you'll probably do worse with an HO than a lopo around town. The HO camshaft doesn't make useful torque under 2500 rpm. You can get away with it if you have a looser torque converter but really those gears just suck in a wagon.


          if you want a cheater way to check for exhaust leaks, spray some oil in the intake. Look for where the smoke comes out.
          86 Lincoln Town Car (Galactica).
          5.0 HO, CompCams XE258,Scorpion 1.72 roller rockers, 3.55 K code rear, tow package, BHPerformance ported E7 heads, Tmoss Explorer intake, 65mm throttle body, Hedman 1 5/8" headers, 2.5" dual exhaust, ASP underdrive pulley

          91 Lincoln Mark VII LSC grandpa spec white and cranberry

          1984 Lincoln Continental TurboDiesel - rolls coal

          Originally posted by phayzer5
          I drive a Lincoln. I can't be bothered to shift like the peasants and rabble rousers

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            #6
            It gets to proper operating temperature now. Thermostat was one-time cut n'dry issue.

            On exhaust: the headers are mac oem-equivalent for a mustang, and the midpipe is a 2nd hand catted stock pipe from craigslist.
            They did not come from the same car; it's possible that especially the used midpipe/hpipe is going to be deformed from years of use on whatever car it lived with.
            Also, they are mounted downwards at a slight angle to accommodate the panther chassis; sloped downward from how they'd be in a mustang. So it's possible they're leaking.
            I'd tried to find gaskets once but couldn't: the cupped circular gaskets were too damned thick and didn't sit right.
            It's also possible the cats could be clogged? How would I know? ...just as I don't know the history of the car the used cats came off of, how many miles, how hard it was driven (and if it could've been sooted up)

            Is it normal practice to retighten new header bolts after a few heat cycles, or should that not be necessary?
            I'll try the oil trick; seems like a good one.

            My 18mpg averages were from when I was mostly driving towson to catonsville: 20 miles of highway.
            Now my commute to work is 5; probably split 2miles on the freeway and 3 miles on <40mph roads with traffic lights. So it's much shorter. Only gets to operating temperature 2-3 miles into the 5 mile trip.
            So that might be a big part of it also.

            I did go with the explorer cam instead of the HO; although I haven't found a good side by side comparison. I know the HO peaks in power @4500rpm and the explorer @4000. In my useable range the curves may not differ much at all?
            Right now I've got the tv cable set so that at WOT it'll tend to be at 3000rpm (I don't really have the chance to see which gears its in, goes through them too quickly and my eyes are on the road). Most of the time it's sitting at 1000 cruising 1500 some gas to get up a hill and 2200 or so when I halfway mash the gas and it goes down a gear to get up a hill at 30mph.
            I suppose i could change those shift points; I was going to ask in another thread if it's worth moving them up further.

            The differential is whatever the stock non-towing-package wagon came with, I had checked once... I know it was something higher than what a stock grand marquis came with. 3.08 rings a bell.
            What would be the next step up in torquey gears? Without entirely killing fuel economy on the highway, mind you-- I know there was someone who put in 4.10 gears and it really hurt. In overdrive with the rev governor for overdrive keeping the engine under 2300rpm, he couldn't go 70mph in overdrive or something near to it (my memory is imperfect).
            How hard and expensive is upgrading the rear diff? ...I suppose there's many a thread buried somewhere on just that.
            Last edited by BerniniCaCO3; 09-26-2011, 08:33 PM.

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              #7
              3.08 is one of the most common gearings. That's what 3 out of 4 of my panthers came with. 3.55 is about the best all around gear-also the stock towing package/HPP gearing that came with limited slip diffs (the sought after K code).....

              Could just drive around with it in D instead of OD to see if that helps milage.
              Builder/Owner of Badass Panther Wagons

              Busy maintaining a fleet of Fords

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