Water Pump 5.0 89 MGM

[Ringting]

Hello,
I trust all are well. Based on seeing coolant on driveway I looked in the engine and found leakage by water pump small hose connections, top left corner.

I ask, how far to go while replacing pump?

SITUATION
Time is not critical, other cars available
1989, 5.0 l, MGM, 62,500 mileage
Signs of coolant leaking at Water Pump and EGR (like everyone else)
15,000 miles since system serviced (upper/lower/thermostat/gasket/Prestone)
100 miles daily usage
Regular oil changes Mobile One, No leaks however losing somehow
A/C not operating

I have many 1990 Mark VII 5.0 I HO engine parts to draw from.

Research has taught me to:
Replace the pump, don’t use Mark VII one
Aluminum body
HO classification
Do not use cork gasket
Be careful when tightening bolts

Timing chain might be worth doing

Are these thoughts correct?
Thanks,
Ringting

From searching the archives I found a number of good threads:
http://www.grandmarq.net/vb/showthre...ences-(picture)

http://www.grandmarq.net/vb/showthread.php?4381-timing-chain-replacement

http://www.grandmarq.net/vb/showthread.php?13339-Questions-about-changing-timing-chain-cover-gasket-and-chain

http://www.grandmarq.net/vb/showthread.php?10534-Timing-chain

http://www.grandmarq.net/vb/showthread.php?6197-prob-should-do-the-timing-chain-too-need-reccomendations

[1990LTD]

If time is not critical and you're going to be in as far as the water pump, I would put a new double roller timing set in (I don't know if stock is double or not but you want a double chain on there.)


If you're in as far as the timing set, the camshaft is not hard to get at. If you change the cam you'll need 19lb injector and the ECU from you mk VII....the firing order on the distributor would have to be switched to the HO/351W firing order. Replace the upper intake with the HO. The lower intakes are identical to both HO and NoPo 5.0 EFI motors. The cylinder heads on the mk VII flow a bit better at high RPM, the heads on your Mercury have high-swirl combustion chambers for low RPM cruising.

I'd replace the thermostat and gasket and all of the coolant/vacuum lines since they would be relatively easy to access while you have it all apart. You do not technically need coolant running to the EGR spacer, I have mine bypassed as do many others.


See how easy it is to justify replacing a ton of shit when you only planned on one small fix?

[gadget73]

62k miles the timing set should be fine. It ought to be a double roller already. You can swap the cam in if you want, but the intake needs to come off, the lifters come out, the radiator comes out, and the AC condensor swings out of the way.

I actually like the HD water pumps, which are iron. They have 2 extra bolts which you'll need to add if you don't currently have a heavy duty pump. Its just common hardware store stuff, 5/16 I believe. It also is usually not a bad idea to remove the back plate from the new water pump and put a light bead of RTV around the gasket just to be sure it doesn't leak out of the backing plate. Replace the belts while they are off if they are old or in bad shape.

[Ringting]

Good day eh,
During my oil pan gasket change out without pulling engine job I took a picture of the chain showing it is double roller. Once I pull things apart the play will be checked.

At 15,000 miles of use I might change the thermostat and belts. Vacuum lines were done previously so inspection only at this point. The advice on RTV is appreciated.

While it would be neat to do the guts it not happening simply due to time. Back at work and busy changing the way patients move throughout the place. Also the community association was vocal about the Mark VII so it was not stripped bare. Some, not all, of the parts mentioned were harvested. I have started a list of what was pulled, anything not needed will be shared with those donating time or money to this board.

Last while focus has been on two BMWs and I will tell you it is nice to get back to a vehicle based on a simple design with space to work.

Oh did I mention how much fun it is watching people in their fancy cars being passed on long steep hills due to their cars not being able to maintain the posted speed limit.
These vehicles are wonderful.

Take care,
Ringting

[rick99601]

im with gadget on the HD pumps

[BerniniCaCO3]

can you elaborate on the HD pumps? I'm building a new engine and want only the most durable and best engineered!
I presume HD =heavy duty; when I go to the auto parts counter, do you have a part number to look for (motorcraft oem, I suppose), or since at autozone the kid at the counter can only look up by vehicle and would thus only see a stock waterpump for my particular car, was there a year/make/model car that had the HD stock and I could just buy that?

thanks!
-Bernard

[gadget73]

yeah, heavy duty pump. Iron housing, I think the impeller is slightly larger, and it has 2 more bolts in it to make sure the gaskets didn't pop. I've always been asked if I needed the aluminum or iron pump for my 86, so maybe tell them you're working on an 86. The iron is the HD one.

[1990LTD]

yeah, heavy duty pump. Iron housing, I think the impeller is slightly larger, and it has 2 more bolts in it to make sure the gaskets didn't pop. I've always been asked if I needed the aluminum or iron pump for my 86, so maybe tell them you're working on an 86. The iron is the HD one.

I assumed the change happened in 88-89 because they needed my VIN to figure out which of the two pumps I needed when I changed my old Mercs water pump years ago.

[rick99601]

after 6/88 theyre aluminum on most. thats the changeover, for sure, without a doubt.

unless autozones wrong...

[1990LTD]

after 6/88 theyre aluminum on most. thats the changeover, for sure, without a doubt.

unless autozones wrong...

I'm wondering if the stocker on my 1990 was replaced at some point..it's got two bolts that the one I replaced it with doesn't have. weirdness.

[P72Ford]

yeah, heavy duty pump. Iron housing, I think the impeller is slightly larger, and it has 2 more bolts in it to make sure the gaskets didn't pop.

Thain is correct.

The aluminum pumps use 7 bolts, the iron pumps use 9.

The iron pumps also have a slightly larger impeller. I was just looking at pumps the other day.

[BerniniCaCO3]

have a part number to research?
Also-- some guy on CL is selling the edelbrock $150 pump for $70, NIB: I might just spring for that

[Ringting]

Greetings,
This past week the vehicle was driven, hit 63,000. Coolant level not really dropping yet some spotting initially when parked.
I went out to buy the water pump and much conflicting information.

PRICING for HD unit, two day turn around
Wholesaler = $42.00, no core, with cork gasket. No clue on FelPRO gasket availability. Said Pass on this
PEP Boys = $79.00, no core, with cork gasket. Not sure about FelPRO gasket availability yet for $2.00 one available. Said bring them in.

Old guy standing in line said be sure to paint it before installing. Comments???

HOSES
Everyone seems lost when I ask for those two small ones. Comments?? One of two installed has a NAPA number marked

Overall quality trumps price here, willing to buy on-line if wisdom says that is the way to go.
Thanks,
Ringting

[Ringting]

OK may have found the needed information simply by re-reading the links above. Posting is from 2006. Link takes you to post were there are links for parts listed

Pics for timing cover and radiator upgrade. http://www.grandmarq.net/vb/showthre...diator-upgrade.
No write-up yet, time still crunching me. But I figured I'd go ahead and post up the pics.

Keep in mind the engine is a 94-95 model mustang engine, so the timing cover and water pump are different.

Parts used:
Waterpump (Ford Racing)
Timing Chain kit (Trick-Flow)
Timing Cover gasket kit (Felpro)
Alluminum 2 row radiator (Summit Racing)
16psi radiator cap (Summit Racing)
Tranny cooler (Flex-A-Lite)

All the pics from the Timing chain/waterpump deal.

http://www.grandmarq.net/blaze/Blaze_Pics/Timing_Cover/

All the pics from the radiator/tranny cooler deal.

http://www.grandmarq.net/blaze/Blaze...iator_Upgrade/

[gadget73]

The two hoses are called the bypass hose and the pump to pipe hose. One goes to the thermostat, the other to the pipe that runs along the lower intake manifold and feeds the heater core.

If you want to paint the water pump, doing it before installation is definitely easier. Its not required, but it looks nice. The iron ones rust, and the aluminum ones eventually just develop a layer of chalky corrosion. Doesn't affect function, but it doesn't look especially nice. If you want to paint the engine accessory brackets, doing it while they are off for the water pump replacement is a good time.

Water pump gaskets aren't cork, at least I've never seen one made of cork. Its like a compressed heavy paper material. Not sure anyone's gasket is especially better than anyone else's in this particular spot.