Will bumping my timing increase mileage?

[89LincolnTWNcar]

I was looking at my balancer while running the other day and it definitely looks like it is wobbling more that it should be. I better get a new just to be safe before something bad happens. What OZ size do I need?

[86VickyLX]

I understand the concept, I just don't know how to adjust it. I would like to experiment and see what is best for my car since scott said every 302 is different in that respect

You can set it with a timing light easily. You would need to disconnect the spout connector at the distributor, and then the engine should be at base timing, which is no ignition timing advance by the computer. This is all assuming that all the timing references are still on the timing cover, the pointer, and that the balancer has 10 btdc marked in someway (whiteout works great for this). Connect the probe of the light around the spark plug wire of cylinder #1. Point the light at the pointer and squeeze the trigger, if it is timed properly, the 10btdc mark should be under the middle of the pointer. If not, you should see the mark either in front of the pointer or behind it. That would be for stock base timing. If it's not there, you can adjust your ignition timing by loosening the bolt at the base of the distributor. If your distributor hasn't been moved or installed or something recently, chances are the o ring has dried up and stuck itself to the intake manifold. Or there's corrosion between the manifold and distributor base. Turn the distributor one way to advance the timing, turn it the other way to retard it. Be sure to mark where it was before you mess with the timing though.

[1987cp]

I was looking at my balancer while running the other day and it definitely looks like it is wobbling more that it should be. I better get a new just to be safe before something bad happens. What OZ size do I need?

What's an "OZ size"? The simplest approach is just to buy a stock replacement balancer specified for your vehicle and engine. Then buy the right size timing tape (think mine was 6-3/8", but measure yours to make sure) and do the piston stop dance to make sure zero really is zero.

[BigT]

I didn't see anyone talk about underdrive pulleys. I've heard they will give you more horsey power and more MPG. Has anyone tried them?

I also read where folks thought underdrive pulleys mess up the engine because there is not as much metal to transfer the vibrations from balancer on the crankshaft and you'll eventually ruin the bottom end. Any truth to that?

[1987cp]

Underdrive pulleys aren't popular for Windsor-motored Panthers because there aren't many available that are known to fit. If you were to go to the hassle of swapping to a full serpentine system like on a Mustang, you could get an underdrive crank pulley for a Mustang, but the box Panther crank pulley is a double pulley and doesn't directly interchange with the serpentine system. There's an actual manufacturer and part number posted around here somewhere, but IIRC it runs around $140 just for the crank pulley, and not many GMNers seem willing to pay that.

[gadget73]

There is one manufacturer that makes one, and no its not cheap. It won't give you much benefit unless you're running at fairly high RPMs either. I have one so my heater core won't blow up, but thats really it.

I call BS on the harmonic problems though. The balancer is what takes care of that. The pulley just spins a belt. It doesn't have anything to do with engine vibration damping.

[1987cp]

I call BS on the harmonic problems though. The balancer is what takes care of that. The pulley just spins a belt. It doesn't have anything to do with engine vibration damping.

I'd missed that part of the post. Wonder if that information was picked up on Corral.net?

[1980c10]

Before my H.O. Swap with bone stock everything I got 20 mpg average with mixed driving. After the H.O. Swap, I also removed the A/C, smog pump, and replaced the clutch fan with an electric, with a mass air conversion also. I was getting 24 mpg average with mixed driving. I can also only run 12 degrees of timing before it pings on 93 but I still have stock H.O. Headers and a restrictive 2 1/4 exhaust which I think is holding me back. Then once I switched my rear gears, went from 3.08 to 4.30's my mpg went from 24 mpg mixed average to 15 mpg mixed average, but I do use the skinny pedal alot more with the 4.30's cause it's alot more fun lol.

[1987cp]

I can also only run 12 degrees of timing before it pings on 93

How certain are you that your 12 degrees really is 12 degrees?

Restrictive exhaust should make a car run richer rather than leaner, all else being equal.

[1987cp]

Then buy the right size timing tape (think mine was 6-3/8", but measure yours to make sure) and do the piston stop dance to make sure zero really is zero.

Checked my old order confirmation; the timing tape I bought is Summit's SUM-163594, for 6-3/8" balancers, and it was actually $3.95.

[1980c10]

Not positive... But it does still have the stock mustang balancer on it. Are the stock ones known to be off? Also I just thought a restrictive exhaust would cause an engine to spark knock much more easily than the same engine with a free flowing exhaust. But maybe that is just something that got cooked up in my own brain lol.

[1987cp]

Not positive... But it does still have the stock mustang balancer on it. Are the stock ones known to be off?

Impossible for me to know; you'll have to check your particular balancer on your particular engine and find out. Logically, any misalignment between the crank centerline and the balancer orientation could result in the timing marks being off even if the balancer is perfect, so it always pays to double-check.

I remember when I first had a balancer off, I saw the big groove on the outside and thought it was supposed to coincide with the crank keyway. Spent several minutes on the phone driving an AutoZone employee very nuts until I finally determined that the balancer I was looking at probably was, in fact, OK.

[gadget73]

There is a degree of innaccuracy allowed in any mass produced part. If its a couple degrees off, honestly it doesn't matter all that much. As long as its not spun, you'll be within a few degrees. Unless you're running an engine that must be tuned absolutely dead on, a degree or so one way or the other won't matter in the long run. I'd be willing to wager that the timing pointer itself is less accurate than the stampings on the balancer are. its just stamped steel and it has a bit of slop in the mounting holes. they also get bent and whatnot, plus add to that how fat the mark is and how good your eye is, and its easy to pick up a few degrees of error.

[1987cp]

I'd be willing to wager that the timing pointer itself is less accurate than the stampings on the balancer are.

You're not alone in that - thus one reason why it's smart to check the timing mark orientation anyway.

Also true that a couple degrees more or less probably doesn't matter for most street engines, but when a n00b sets his base timing where his buddy said to and it pings, and there's nothing serious wrong with his engine, I imagine he'll appreciate knowing that his and his buddy's particular balancer/pointer combos may be reading differently.