Flex Fuel E85

[mfmagicmike]

Has anyone experience with the flex fuel conversion on the 302 cid 5.0 SEFI Windsor engine ?

[Mercmarquis]

That would be an interesting mod... The problems are replacing anything the alcohol would corrode and eat, as well as delivering the extra fuel it requires.

Doing it with a carb would be alot easier tho. But still no walk in the park. You would need new seals in the tank for the pickup and sending unit. All stainless steel fuel line in a larger size (at least 3/8") as e85 motor uses more fuel. The pump would need to be alcohol compatible (I think holley's black pump is). Of course you carb would need to be modified to work with the alcohol (drill larger passages, replace anything rubber or anything that the alcohol would corrode). You can also buy carbs from a bunch of manufacturers that are already set up for e85 as well. Edelbrock, quickfuel... just to name a few.

Ford has never made a 5.0 flex fuel, accually no V8's until last year with the 4.6 in a crown vic IIRC. Only exploders, tauruses and rangers. So that rules out any ford type EEC swaps.

The only way I could see doing it with EFI would be a stand alone FI control such as Fast XFI, Accel and the others. I think Even megasquirt works.

[Mercmarquis]

But the problem with going carb is, no going back to gas with out swapping your carb and making other tuning adjustments.

Also doing it with a stand alone would not be on the fly either, You can have the parameters for the EFI computer downloaded on a laptop and switch it when you fill up with gasoline.

[gadget73]

making it run on e85 can be done, but being able to flip back and forth would be a problem. Only way I can think of to do this in any practical way would be to use a mustang motor and ecm along with a tuner that allows multiple programs. Main reason for the Mustang ECM is that the Vic ones don't take a chip. Mark VII computers can, but thats also an HO computer. The tweecer can do 4 programs. One program for gasoline, one for e85. It could be done with production Ford stuff, but its going to require some custom tuning, there is no off the shelf solution. It also won't auto-flip the program, you'd need to do this manually. Might also have to step up to a larger injector to handle the extra fuel demands of e85. I'm also not sure about the O2 sensors. stoich for e85 is different than stoich for gas, so the stock narrow band sensors won't work right. probably would need to switch to wide band sensors and alter the tune to accept that data.

[gabegt90]

My dad's 06 grand marquis is a flex fuel car

[gadget73]

My dad's 06 grand marquis is a flex fuel car

thats also not a 5.0 windsor motor.

[interceptor1985]

That would be an interesting mod... The problems are replacing anything the alcohol would corrode and eat, as well as delivering the extra fuel it requires.

Doing it with a carb would be alot easier tho. But still no walk in the park. You would need new seals in the tank for the pickup and sending unit. All stainless steel fuel line in a larger size (at least 3/8") as e85 motor uses more fuel. The pump would need to be alcohol compatible (I think holley's black pump is). Of course you carb would need to be modified to work with the alcohol (drill larger passages, replace anything rubber or anything that the alcohol would corrode). You can also buy carbs from a bunch of manufacturers that are already set up for e85 as well. Edelbrock, quickfuel... just to name a few.

Ford has never made a 5.0 flex fuel, accually no V8's until last year with the 4.6 in a crown vic IIRC. Only exploders, tauruses and rangers. So that rules out any ford type EEC swaps.

The only way I could see doing it with EFI would be a stand alone FI control such as Fast XFI, Accel and the others. I think Even megasquirt works.

How about in my 74 Capri? I have the 2.0(pinto) engine with a weber carb and a header. it is a 4 speed though if I was driving it every day I would want a 5 speed.

[Mercmarquis]

e85 in the capri? AFAIK the only motors ford made flex fuel were the v6's. And lately the 4.6 and supposedly the 5.4 is going to be available. So I think it would be nearly the same as outlined above.

Either you can go with a carb and stay with ethanol. Unless you switch carbs, and make alot of other adjustments. Or go stand alone EFI and switch your tuning programs through chips, laptops...ect.

[Grand Marquis GT]

If it's available, i've heard GREAT things abut it as a performance fuel...

[Mercmarquis]

If you can find it, e85 is the greatest thing since sliced bread.

Has like 104 octane but is equivelent to something like a 112 octane fuel cause it burns cooler. (dont quote me on those octane #'s) Can run more compression/boost/timing ect... Runs cooler and costs much less than a gallon of premium gas and hell of alot more cheaper than C16 or any other race fuel.

[P72Ford]

Running any alcohol is going to net you a decrease in fuel mileage. I once heard it takes 1.6 gallons of alcohol to do what a gallon of gasoline can. Alcohol doesn't contain the energy per gallon that gasoline does, despite its high octane, etc. Thats one reason why its cheaper than premium gas... it better damn well be.

[mfmagicmike]

I have read articles about the US made EPA aprooved flex fuel system. It seemed very much easier to install than You are saying it is. They are saying that all You have to do is change ALL the filters & oil, and connect each injector to the flex fuel chip, the original connectors from the cars chip being also connected to the flex fuel chip. The exhaust oxygen sensors are also connected to the system. It is then supposed to adapt automatically the injection volume to the type of gasoline that is being burned (either gasoline or E85).
So theoretically You could use either fuel as accessible.
No changes to the fuel pump or the fuel lines or rubber parts were mentioned.
Check out their site (flexfuel.com or so) and tell me You think of it.

[Mercmarquis]

anything rubber or untreated aluminum will corrode with ethanol, maybe not tomorrow but it will happen. I dont think old stock injectors will like the ethanol or be able to supply enough fuel anyway. I also think they arent taking into consideration the timing adjustments that need be done. Just sounds real fishy to me.

[Lincolnmania]

corn is for food and to make whiskey......not fuel for cars and stoves.....anybody check corn prices lately?

[torquelover]

In a relatives '06 Impala, E85 has less power and you spend more money on fuel in the long run. I wonder why GM couldn't take advantage of the increased octane for some power. At least then E85 makes sense to me. Around here, there's not a big enough difference price-wise compared to 87 octane unleaded for E85 to be successful.