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    #1

    ping

    getting a ping in 3rd and 4th gear under load. started after i adjusted the timing a 2nd time (first time i set it to 10* but it had a vac leak i capped off) from TDC (0*)

    power is excellent and i even backed it down to 9* but still get a ping.


    just cheapo gas? running 89 octane. i wirebrushed the heads and pistons when i did the HO junk so no carbon deposits.



    BTW scott you were right about the timing. mine was at 0* when i checked it initally. had much more power even after the 1st adjustment, runs excellent now.. still slow)
    LTD is still here
    Tags: None
    #2
    What exactly is done to the car? Is the balancer new? It's possible that the outer ring has spun on the rubber, happens a lot on Mustangs.
    1989 Town Car Cartier: 3G Alt. Upgrade, Mark VIII Electric Fan, Police Interceptor Suspension, 40-series Flows, loaded. HO+ Conversion: E7 heads, Cobra 1.7RR's, Explorer intake, 65mm TB, FMS "E" Camshaft, 4-hole 19lb/hr injectors, A9P ECM, 76mm C&L MAF, BBK CAI. 338,000Km, stock bottom-end.

    Comment

      #3
      shouldn't ping with 89 and 10*... I've always run way more timing with 87... Might want to double check the balancer.
      Builder/Owner of Badass Panther Wagons

      Busy maintaining a fleet of Fords

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        #4
        yeah i dont trust the balancer eighter. i got like 4 more i can try.
        LTD is still here

        Comment

          #5
          Yeah, I know I've had mine up to 14 degrees with 87 octane and no ping.

          Comment

            #6
            odd.

            i'm going to back it down a hair for now. since adjusting the timing, i've had the urge to drive the fuck outta it. HO conversion really woke it up some. cant wait for the 4.10 gears & trac-loc.


            BTW OVERKILL are you running stock lopo pistons or HO pistons w/ valve reliefs? i have 1.7 rockers but they interfered with the lopo piston with E7 heads and an HO cam.
            LTD is still here

            Comment

              #7
              Originally posted by 1987LTDmasta View Post
              odd.

              i'm going to back it down a hair for now. since adjusting the timing, i've had the urge to drive the fuck outta it. HO conversion really woke it up some. cant wait for the 4.10 gears & trac-loc.


              BTW OVERKILL are you running stock lopo pistons or HO pistons w/ valve reliefs? i have 1.7 rockers but they interfered with the lopo piston with E7 heads and an HO cam.
              The rocker ratio has no bearing on piston to valve clearance, if you had contact with 1.7's, then they would hit with 1.6's. Interference occurs at low lift, where the valve is chasing the piston down the bore, or the piston chasing the valve up it. In either instance, the valve is never even close to being fully open, which is where the increased ratio makes it's largest gains; when the valve is fully open. We are talking a maximum difference of .005 to .010 difference between 1.6's and 1.7's in the interference range. Since piston to valve clearance is supposed to be at LEAST .085, as you can tell, that definitely was not your issue.

              Sounds to me like your cam timing was way off, or it wasn't an HO camshaft.

              And I am running the stock lopo pistons with the small dish and no valve reliefs with 1.7 rockers on god knows what cam.

              Did you actually CLAY it and measure your clearance?
              1989 Town Car Cartier: 3G Alt. Upgrade, Mark VIII Electric Fan, Police Interceptor Suspension, 40-series Flows, loaded. HO+ Conversion: E7 heads, Cobra 1.7RR's, Explorer intake, 65mm TB, FMS "E" Camshaft, 4-hole 19lb/hr injectors, A9P ECM, 76mm C&L MAF, BBK CAI. 338,000Km, stock bottom-end.

              Comment

                #8
                yeah i did clay. after claying, measuring, and talking to a bunch of mustang techs here locally, i didnt want to take that risk. seemed to close for comfort. also the whole valve cover problem was another reason why i decided not to use them.

                no big deal for me. i dont make enough power for it to matter. 4.10s and forced induciton is probably as far as i will go with it.
                LTD is still here

                Comment

                  #9
                  Originally posted by 1987LTDmasta View Post
                  yeah i did clay. after claying, measuring, and talking to a bunch of mustang techs here locally, i didnt want to take that risk. seemed to close for comfort. also the whole valve cover problem was another reason why i decided not to use them.

                  no big deal for me. i dont make enough power for it to matter. 4.10s and forced induciton is probably as far as i will go with it.

                  Yeah, the valve cover thing is a bit of a PITA. The info above was provided to me by a cam grinder, one who is very well known in many racing circles and definitely knows what the hell he's talking about.

                  Do you have less than .085 currently for clearance?
                  1989 Town Car Cartier: 3G Alt. Upgrade, Mark VIII Electric Fan, Police Interceptor Suspension, 40-series Flows, loaded. HO+ Conversion: E7 heads, Cobra 1.7RR's, Explorer intake, 65mm TB, FMS "E" Camshaft, 4-hole 19lb/hr injectors, A9P ECM, 76mm C&L MAF, BBK CAI. 338,000Km, stock bottom-end.

                  Comment

                    #10
                    Originally posted by 1987LTDmasta View Post
                    odd.

                    i'm going to back it down a hair for now. since adjusting the timing, i've had the urge to drive the fuck outta it. HO conversion really woke it up some. cant wait for the 4.10 gears & trac-loc.
                    I'm afraid I'll be doing the same thing when new motor time rolls around for me. I'd been driving the bejesus out of my stocker and it's gonna be hard not to be hard on teh new one, especially with a powerband moved up 1500rpm.
                    1990 Country Squire - under restoration
                    1988 Crown Vic LTD Wagon - daily beater

                    GMN Box Panther History
                    Box Panther Horsepower and Torque Ratings
                    Box Panther Production Numbers

                    Comment

                      #11
                      ping under the conditions you describe are classic symptoms of an EGR system not working correctly.
                      all your stuff hooked up correctly?

                      on a side note. I always replace the harmonic balancer when I build a motor. Most dealers keep them in stock and at $60 with a new timing pointer is a deal.
                      2003 Town Car Signature - 3.27 RAR, Dual exhaust and J-mod - SOLD 9/2011
                      89 Crown Victoria LX HPP -- SOLD 9/2010
                      88 Grand Marquis LS - The Original -- Totaled 5/2006

                      I rebuild AOD/AODE/4R70W/4R75E transmissions....Check out my Facebook page: https://www.facebook.com/pages/North...48414635312478

                      Comment

                        #12
                        And if you are REALLY anal, I'd get a Pioneer SFI one. They are about the most affordable SFI balancers and are very high quality.
                        1989 Town Car Cartier: 3G Alt. Upgrade, Mark VIII Electric Fan, Police Interceptor Suspension, 40-series Flows, loaded. HO+ Conversion: E7 heads, Cobra 1.7RR's, Explorer intake, 65mm TB, FMS "E" Camshaft, 4-hole 19lb/hr injectors, A9P ECM, 76mm C&L MAF, BBK CAI. 338,000Km, stock bottom-end.

                        Comment

                          #13
                          Originally posted by OVERKILL View Post
                          And if you are REALLY anal, I'd get a Pioneer SFI one. They are about the most affordable SFI balancers and are very high quality.

                          past 2 times I tried to order the pioneer, it was on back order.
                          anyway, unless the motor sees a lot of track time and stays at high RPM for a long time, SFI stuff isnt needed.
                          2003 Town Car Signature - 3.27 RAR, Dual exhaust and J-mod - SOLD 9/2011
                          89 Crown Victoria LX HPP -- SOLD 9/2010
                          88 Grand Marquis LS - The Original -- Totaled 5/2006

                          I rebuild AOD/AODE/4R70W/4R75E transmissions....Check out my Facebook page: https://www.facebook.com/pages/North...48414635312478

                          Comment

                            #14
                            Originally posted by 88grandmarq View Post
                            ping under the conditions you describe are classic symptoms of an EGR system not working correctly.
                            all your stuff hooked up correctly?

                            on a side note. I always replace the harmonic balancer when I build a motor. Most dealers keep them in stock and at $60 with a new timing pointer is a deal.
                            EGR? whats that?

                            LOL. it wasnt doing this with the old setup. it hasnt been working since i bought the car, and dont plan on ever making it work, espeically now that i dont need to take it to the emissions.

                            i put in 93 octane today and the ping is gone. going to leave it as-is. once i find an EGR blockoff plate i'm going to remove the EGR entirely.

                            BTW alot of Mustang guys run without an EGR eighter and they dont seem to be having that issue.
                            LTD is still here

                            Comment

                              #15
                              Originally posted by OVERKILL View Post
                              The rocker ratio has no bearing on piston to valve clearance, if you had contact with 1.7's, then they would hit with 1.6's. Interference occurs at low lift, where the valve is chasing the piston down the bore, or the piston chasing the valve up it. In either instance, the valve is never even close to being fully open, which is where the increased ratio makes it's largest gains; when the valve is fully open. We are talking a maximum difference of .005 to .010 difference between 1.6's and 1.7's in the interference range. Since piston to valve clearance is supposed to be at LEAST .085, as you can tell, that definitely was not your issue.
                              That's not entirely clear there. Though the higher ratio rockers make their largest impact ac full lift, that not only is irrelevant o clearance issues, it also is irrelevant to the max flow rate in some applications, as their is a max valve lift that results in higher flow. At some point in the lift you don't get anymore flow no matter how much more you open it, because something else is the bottle neck. THE BIGGEST advantage of higher ratio rockers is that the valve opens faster. This means as the valve is chasing the piston down or up, it's now moving faster than it was with the 1.6 ratios, so using 1.7 ratio rockers can in some situations cause interference where a 1.6 may not, even with the same heads, pistons, cam.

                              Comment

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