1989 Town Car HO Conversion running rich

[OVERKILL]

Have you unplugged the battery and turned on the lights for a bit. This resets the base programing. The program then offsets for production tollerances in manufacturing of sensors.

I also had trouble with surging at one point in the blue tudor. Part of the issue could be the idle air bypass also there are different ones they have different orfice sizes in them. Some are just dirty and need cleaned. I dont remember what I ended up using but do remember building one out of three of them and after that and some screwing around with the idle screw it finialy settled down.

Well, I changed out one O2 and it made a difference, so, I'm changing them both out for a couple of new ones I have kicking around tomorrow, so we'll see how that goes.

I've reset the ECM numerous times, pretty much anytime I make a drastic change, IE, a sensor swap.

I still think I may have nuked the O2's when the timing was retarded..........

[turbo2256b]

Have you unplugged the battery and turned on the lights for a bit. This resets the base programing. The program then offsets for production tollerances in manufacturing of sensors.

I also had trouble with surging at one point in the blue tudor. Part of the issue could be the idle air bypass also there are different ones they have different orfice sizes in them. Some are just dirty and need cleaned. I dont remember what I ended up using but do remember building one out of three of them and after that and some screwing around with the idle screw it finialy settled down.

[OVERKILL]

Is it a new sensor.??? The odds of that sensor going bad is slim, but it is a mechanical component. It will go bad at some point.

The ACT? Yeah, its new, and I've tried another one too, but to no avail.


The water made the car act a little different, but didn't help the surging.......


Now, I pulled out one of the O2's, and it was black, so I stuck one of the original ones in there, and it seemed to help a bit. I'll try changing out the other side maybe later, driving with the ACT sitting on the manifold and the one old O2 and see how it goes.........

[Enigma]

Is it a new sensor.??? The odds of that sensor going bad is slim, but it is a mechanical component. It will go bad at some point.

[OVERKILL]

A pan of boiling water might be a better idea

That's actually a very smart idea............... I'm going to try that RIGHT NOW, BRB.

-Chris

[turbo2256b]

A pan of boiling water might be a better idea

[OVERKILL]

The ACT sensor is still my guess. It sends back a signal based on temp. I dont know if the one in the manifold is the same as the one in the air box. I do know the temp erature in the air box is much lower than in the intake. If the ECM was calibrated for it in the manifold thats were it needs to be. If calibrated in the air box it should be there . The Mustangs you mention that had there s relocated might have worked well because they were modified to the point they needed extra fuel and wass a way to do it with out changeing injectors ECM and related componets. Some have changed the thermostat with similar results. Your like in perminate choke mode. I remember relocating the ACT sensors cant remember what year it started. Jusst remember redesigning air boxes to accept them. Reason it was some sort of improvement sensing actual air temperature with out engine componet temps ssuch as intake metal teems bleeding in to the calibration. To put it another way the air temp in the intake might realy be guessing 100 degrees the intake metal temp might be to hot to touch for long or on initial start freezing such as your 2* day you mentioned. You can see that would be a troublesome issue to deal with calibratiing an engine ad to that meeting tight emission standards. Relocating to the air box the air temp would more consistant due to the more stable temp.

Yes, except I put the sensor right in the valley beside the injector, where the air is hot, and it still acts up. Now of course, I could hold a lighter up to it and see if that does anything...........

[turbo2256b]

The ACT sensor is still my guess. It sends back a signal based on temp. I dont know if the one in the manifold is the same as the one in the air box. I do know the temp erature in the air box is much lower than in the intake. If the ECM was calibrated for it in the manifold thats were it needs to be. If calibrated in the air box it should be there . The Mustangs you mention that had there s relocated might have worked well because they were modified to the point they needed extra fuel and wass a way to do it with out changeing injectors ECM and related componets. Some have changed the thermostat with similar results. Your like in perminate choke mode. I remember relocating the ACT sensors cant remember what year it started. Jusst remember redesigning air boxes to accept them. Reason it was some sort of improvement sensing actual air temperature with out engine componet temps ssuch as intake metal teems bleeding in to the calibration. To put it another way the air temp in the intake might realy be guessing 100 degrees the intake metal temp might be to hot to touch for long or on initial start freezing such as your 2* day you mentioned. You can see that would be a troublesome issue to deal with calibratiing an engine ad to that meeting tight emission standards. Relocating to the air box the air temp would more consistant due to the more stable temp.

[OVERKILL]

hey overkill, i notice you live in ontario as well, im from london ontario,,

Nice! A buddy of mine grew up in Glencoe and was up until last year, living in Strathroy. God that area is SO FLAT, you could put a drag strip anywhere

[OVERKILL]

OK, update on the insanity with my car.

So, new injectors seem to be working well.

If I plug the ACT in, the car surges. It doesn't stall, but its undrivable.

With the ACT unplugged, the car is "soft" off the line, IE, throttle response is a bit lack-luster and of course the "Check Engine" light is on.

With the ACT unplugged, the car will idle smoothly with the IAC unplugged, so I can set the idle.

If i try to do that with the ACT plugged in, it surges and cannot be done.

Its not missing anymore (injectors fixed that) but this last aggravation is quite irritating.

I have tried putting the ACT on the surface of the intake, to emulate the heat it might experience in the runner, this had no effect.

With the ACT plugged in, the car runs rediculously rich, but with it unplugged, its pretty much" normal".

This is quite baffling. The only sensor I haven't checked at this point are the O2's, which I may do this afternoon when I have some time, though how the ACT surging could possibly be caused by the O2's, well, it just doesn't make sense to me. I may try to find a bad ground or something.

I was thinking about trying my old Mustang ECM for shits and grins....................

This is VERY frustrating, as, logic would dictate, the car SHOULD be running like a top ATM.

Its pulling wicked vacuum, almost 19lbs at idle and its steady (with the ACT unplugged).

I have tried two different MAP sensors, and that made no difference.

I may try pulling codes again later, though I know its simply going to bitch about the ACT being unplugged.

Maybe I'll luck out and found I melted an O2 or something

hey overkill, i notice you live in ontario as well, im from london ontario,,

[OVERKILL]

Well, I put all new injectors in it today, and ran it. It ran a LOT better. I still need to work on setting the idle. I set it when I first fired it up, but there was some combustion chamber cleaner in the upper intake (I was trying to clean out some of the crap left over from when the EGR spacer was leaking) so I think that effected my results. Its too late to try now (neighbours will complain) so I'll keep you updated on my progress tomorrow.

FUN STUFF!

-Chris

[gadget73]

I rebuilt a Mark VII motor for my car. When I pulled it, it ran like a dream with 120k. Now with all new guts it doesnt make the power it should. Trust me, I understand the annoyance in all this.

[OVERKILL]

::Small rant::

The frustrating part about this is the aloofness of the issue.

The Mustang, with far more mods, took to these things so candidly, and without issue. Its very obvious why people switch to MAF; its so much better at hiding underlying issues.

I've read most of the GFUB, understand the EEC-IV strategy and logic quite well, and I would THINK that with that knowledge, this would be very simple to figure out, yet its not.

Is it because its freezing out and I don't want to work on the car? possibly.

Is it because the Capri is 20ft from the Lincoln, its not my DD and I'd rather work on it? Yeah, that too.

Is it because I'd like this problem to just fix itself, since it shouldn't exist in the first place? Yeah, a little bit of that also.....

It was such a SIMPLE swap of known-good parts, and that is what aggravates me so. The fact it has the audacity to act like such a bitch after I've spent this sort of time and money on her....the nerve!


I could swear it started running a bit better tonight after the two kegs of injector cleaner, bu that could just be me wanting it to be running better. I'll know for sure tomorrow I hope.

[OVERKILL]

Wonder if one of those injectors isn't shot and leaking fuel. Are all the plugs equally as dark, or does one seem darker than the other? If you pull the vacuum hose off the fuel pressure regulator, does fuel come out? What kind of regulator, stock or adjustable?

I could swear that one is darker than the others, #6 I think.

The plugs are all pretty dark though...........

If I pull the vacuum hose, no gas comes out, and the regulator is stock.

I've put TWO containers of injector cleaner in it tonight, we'll see if that helps. If not, I've got an entire other set of injectors I could try that probably have half the mileage these ones do. The REASON I used these ones is they came out of my Mustang, so they were known good but of course have been sitting for quite some time.