Check this out!!

[tjc78]

It doesn't matter how much better the Civic does on FE. The initial purchase cost is much higher and offsets the MPG significantly. Less miles driven only makes it less of a difference.

Total cost of ownership for an 05 Civic and an 80s box Town Car purchased today will be significantly higher for the 05 every time.

And I think my 8 MPG difference for a 50/50 driving mix is pretty close but, for shits and giggles looked it up on Fueleconomy.org and an 05 Civic 1.7 4At is rated at 30combined. An 89 LTC is rated at 18 combined.

So, instead of 7 years it would still be almost 5 years before you would get your initial purchase price back in gas savings.

[turbo2256b]

Dosent hold water to my GM when I had the economy engine build at 22 city and 32.9 highway. Pluss all the people and luggage that could be hauled.

[johnunit]

It doesn't matter how much better the Civic does on FE. The initial purchase cost is much higher and offsets the MPG significantly. Less miles driven only makes it less of a difference.

Total cost of ownership for an 05 Civic and an 80s box Town Car purchased today will be significantly higher for the 05 every time.

And I think my 8 MPG difference for a 50/50 driving mix is pretty close but, for shits and giggles looked it up on Fueleconomy.org and an 05 Civic 1.7 4At is rated at 30combined. An 89 LTC is rated at 18 combined.

So, instead of 7 years it would still be almost 5 years before you would get your initial purchase price back in gas savings.

5 years gets pretty close to "probably will make it up" IMO.


And I've politely left out the cost of repairs over that time...


I love my crown vic, it's better than any economy car in a lot of ways, but cost of ownership as a commuter is not one of them. And frankly, unless you dump enough money into a restoration that you've killed the initial purchase price advantage, reliability generally isn't either. They're comfortable, they're durable to all kinds of abuse, they're cool looking, they've got space for all your enemies in the trunk and all your girlfriends in the passenger compartment, but they're not cheaper to drive significant mileage over time at today's gas prices.

[tjc78]

5 years gets pretty close to "probably will make it up" IMO.


And I've politely left out the cost of repairs over that time...


I love my crown vic, it's better than any economy car in a lot of ways, but cost of ownership as a commuter is not one of them. And frankly, unless you dump enough money into a restoration that you've killed the initial purchase price advantage, reliability generally isn't either. They're comfortable, they're durable to all kinds of abuse, they're cool looking, they've got space for all your enemies in the trunk and all your girlfriends in the passenger compartment, but they're not cheaper to drive significant mileage over time at today's gas prices.

You think a miled up 05 Civic isn't going to need maintenance and repair? A few bum sensors and a T-belt would drain your wallet significantly.

I'm not trying to say you don't have points, but people only look at MPG not the overall picture. You also need to think about how you would purchase the Civic. Most people would buy the box in cash, a newer car would most likely need to be financed. Financing isn't free, that interest cost is part of ownership.

8500 financed for 48 months @7% equals about $1270 in interest charges.

[johnunit]

You think a miled up 05 Civic isn't going to need maintenance and repair? A few bum sensors and a T-belt would drain your wallet significantly.

Not as much as a 20+ year old panther that will almost always need body mounts and control arm bushings, at minimum, plus all the other stuff we know is usually wrong with them. And again, it's going to be hard/expensive for someone to find a shop to work on these cars, unless you happen to be close to Scott.

I'm not trying to say you don't have points, but people only look at MPG not the overall picture. You also need to think about how you would purchase the Civic. Most people would buy the box in cash, a newer car would most likely need to be financed. Financing isn't free, that interest cost is part of ownership.

8500 financed for 48 months @7% equals about $1270 in interest charges.

This I can agree with. I have never financed a car and do not ever intend to.

[TFatseas]

I don't see the point of this argument.

We obviously know a 20-25+ year old car is going to cost more in everyday use, but I buy these cars because I like them,(I'm pretty sure that's why most of us are on this website) not because I did some long term cost benefit analysis and realize I'd come out ahead.

[tjc78]

I don't see the point of this argument.

The point is that while the older car will cost more to drive/maintain on a daily basis, the overall cost over time isn't as significant as it seems. Any newer car has much more up front cost than an older car which in turn offsets the MPG gain.

Its no different than all the CFC people who traded in paid off gas hogs and created a monthly nut to save $50 a month on gas.

[sly]

I don't see the point of comparing a land yacht to an econobox. well of course you'll get better gas mileage in the shitbox... and the first idiot that dings it off the road will have it totaled. my 88 has been run off the road by a saturn vue, nailed in the driver side by 2 G6s and been nailed on the passenger side by a 2000 ish taurus. none of them left any real lasting damage that acetone and a shop towel couldn't wipe off (wipe the other car's paint off mine as it were).

Compare the cost of buying an older land yacht to a newer "full size" car and then tell me the newer car is better. The new full size taurus gets WORSE gas mileage than the 92-97 aero vics (non-hpp and the same mileage as the HPP vics) and still can't pull as much or carry as many people.

compare apples to apples as close as you can or piss off. An econobox will never replace a full size car for capability.

[Rollwithit]

I have people all the time trying to convince me that I need to "modernize" and buy something newer and smaller. The last time I did that, I traded a mint 1977 loaded Chevrolet Malibu Classic with 350 4 barrel and received a credit of $900.00. A friend (who didn't try to convince me to trade) called me and got perverted joy out of telling me he had seen my car on a used car lot for $4000.00! And, it sold within the week! What did I trade for? A 1991 Ford Probe. High insurance, car payments and the whole ball of wax. I vowed I would never do that to myself again. If and when I do buy an economy car, it'll probably be an old used Escort or Focus paid for with cash. No car payments!

[miamibob]

My girlfriend refers to my 87 GM (Dark Clove Metalic) as the "old chocolate bar" and constantly tells me to get rid of it. Besides the heater core bypassed (not a big issue here) it is mint. Told her I'd rather get a new girlfriend but she liked that idea even less! Bobby

[marquisman]

My girlfriend refers to my 87 GM (Dark Clove Metalic) as the "old chocolate bar" and constantly tells me to get rid of it. Besides the heater core bypassed (not a big issue here) it is mint. Told her I'd rather get a new girlfriend but she liked that idea even less! Bobby

I bet, cause old car is always better than old womangs lol.

[marquisman]

i don't see the point of comparing a land yacht to an econobox. Well of course you'll get better gas mileage in the shitbox... And the first idiot that dings it off the road will have it totaled. My 88 has been run off the road by a saturn vue, nailed in the driver side by 2 g6s and been nailed on the passenger side by a 2000 ish taurus. None of them left any real lasting damage that acetone and a shop towel couldn't wipe off (wipe the other car's paint off mine as it were).

Compare the cost of buying an older land yacht to a newer "full size" car and then tell me the newer car is better. The new full size taurus gets worse gas mileage than the 92-97 aero vics (non-hpp and the same mileage as the hpp vics) and still can't pull as much or carry as many people.

Compare apples to apples as close as you can or piss off. An econobox will never replace a full size car for capability.

this!

[whitemgm]

Wow! alot has happened in this thread while I was away! I too have wondered why more people don't drive these cars. It really depends on your needs I guess. If you drive 50 miles to work every day and you are the only one in your car, then yes you should drive a rice rocket. But if you are like me and just use it for a family car/occasional tripmobile then it is awesome! Speaking as a former Honda Civic owner, I can say my Grand Marquis is far superior in most respects except fuel mileage. But for the driving that we do, I would rather get 23 mpg and be comfortable than get 36 and be cramped and listening to a whole lot of road noise.

[79lincolnlover]

No car payments!

Cash payment is how I roll.

[whitemgm]

Yeah no kidding!